Part one. Levels of understanding, Philosophy 909 Dec. 9, 2002

Recently, I've been called all kinds of things trying to make a simple complex point. I wish to explain where it is I'm coming from. I am not trying to convert or make anyone anything.  I am not preaching religion here. I am not trying to down grade any religion or person.

Here is what it is all about for the first email. I plan to follow with how it relates to religion to me.

I believe in life, there are levels of thinking that one can reach.
I reached my first one, that I knew about, at the age of thirty five.
This was one of the biggest ones, as I noted it. Levels seem to be reached by what you have learned in life and how old you are. There were plenty of levels reached before this time, but I never was able to note this fact, until this time.
Individuals do not have to go though the same levels as others. They may take a different path, and go through different levels in different orders than others and at different times.

At thirty five, I had been working for HP for  about seven years.
I worked in Reliability Physics.  What happened is one day I discovered I was giving advice and helping just about everyone in the company with there tech problems.
I was working with the so called best engineers and giving them advice.
I was just  a country kid, and didn't even finish electronic Engineering school.
When I started, I had to test things three times, just to make sure I was right, because they all wanted to shoot me down so to speak. Engineers are that way.
After a number of years doing this and solving problems that have been around for years that no one else could solve, they started listening to me.

Anyway, what it did was give me big time confidence in myself.
I can think with the best.
This confidence was this thinking plane that I reached.
This confidence gave me even more thinking power is how I will explain it.

I don't know what the number of this plane was. It wouldn't be the same for everyone. It doesn't matter where you start, but it does matter where you finish, if you care.  You will only care, if you get to one of these planes.
Once you can note the first one, you can look for the next. It could take a short time or a long time.
I've noted a several more small ones on the way to 55.
Now, at 55, I may have hit another big one, I'm not sure yet.
I've been waiting a long time to enter whatever this phase brings.

One can reach these thinking planes by having an open mind.
If one shuts it, one is stuck in that plane and will not advance in the same way as one that can keep an open mind.

Any body see any religion in this?
No, they are just thoughts. :O)
I suppose one could make it a religion, but I will not.
These are thoughts from the mind.
I've not read them in any books, but there likely are books about this.

I do know that as you progress and understand, you can appreciate things much, much better and will understand people, much better.
You can be much happier with things. If you reach the right plane, things will happen in a more positive way. Not everyone will reach these planes, but everyone is capable of it.

Now I'm not trying to brag about the plane that I'm on or say I'm better or worst than anyone else.
I'm just stating where I'm coming from.
You figure out where you are and if you don't like it, do something about it. :O)


One nice thing about the planes is if you can get to a high enough one, one can understand where other people are coming from better, although one does not still have to agree.
The level one can reach is related to what one understands about all things in the universe.

The next email in this series will be how I understand religion fits into this.
I will not write it to put anyone down. Only to pass on what I've come to understand. It may not be what you have come to understand and that's all right. It still fits.

Bob Noble
www.sonic.net/bnoble

I admit a lot of this is coming together as I'm writing it.
It's because, it is one thing to feel something, but another thing to put that feeling in terms that others can understand.  So, I started out with Levels of thinking. After sleeping on it, and re-reading it, the word understanding just seemed to fit what it was, I was trying to communicate. Thus the change. Most of the places I used the word, thinking, in the previous email, now called, understanding, the word understanding, can be substituted for the word thinking to help make all this more understandable. :O)

Understanding=thinking

So, as you remember, I said, I believe there are Levels of Understanding one can reach in one's life.

This email is supposed to demo how religion fits in with this idea. As to remain positive and not offend any religions, I wish to use the word religion in a worldly way, meaning all religions, any and everywhere. This means I am not referring to any religion specifically. If one thinks I'm specifically talking about their religion, it is in their mind, not mine. :O)

But I need to use the religion word to explain how things inter-relate, so I'm stuck, using the word.

It's not so difficult or confusing as one may think.
The easiest way to get started might be with an example.

Let's say, I'm born and start to use my mind, somewhere along the way of life.
I've moved to a new Level of Understanding, but I could not know at that young age. This part happens to all of us.

I move up the levels as I learn and get older, but I still do not know about the levels. Some might, at this age. I didn't.

You advance in life, until you reach the level of noting there are levels.
This is a meaningful level. I was about thirty five when it happened to me. One doesn't have to note there are levels to advance. And we all advance in our own method. I think this is very important. It's what makes us, us. :O)

It is not important for everyone to advance to a high level. There are lots of reasons people are at their level, or get stuck on their level, for a long time.

If one gets to a high enough level, they will understand and know that it doesn't matter who is higher or who is lower. If you think it does, you need to advance to higher levels, until you do.

It's only those at the lower levels that don't understand, and would revert to name calling and such. Higher levels do understand and do not need to do this.

So, where does religion fit into this.
Remember, this is not referring to any religion, but all religions in general.

When one gets caught up in a religion, they can reach higher levels of understanding. They can move way ahead of others in their understanding. But they tend to stall. Why?

It's because all religions on earth, except one I know of, which isn't a religion, uses man terms to describe their religion.  Once a religion uses man terms to describe a religion, and the longer it does this, the more distorted the original religion becomes.
The truth is all in there, but it is hidden among all the untruths, added along the way of time, and it is very hard to sort out.

Let me describe what I mean by man terms in thinking.
If one thinks of something in terms of the words a man thinks, which is what can be printed, this is what I call man terms.

Man terms are great for thinking about things, but one can not tell what is truth sometimes.
This is a limit that will limit ones thinking, and limit ones advancing to higher levels.

So, we need something else and there is something else.
My cousin showed me a better word for it today.
It's what we need, to get away from thinking in the man terms.

If we don't wish to think in man terms, we can think spiritually.
That's the word, spiritually. To be able to think spiritually, one has to be able to get past the man term thing.  This doesn't mean that the man term thing isn't any good. But now that one can think spiritually, one should be able to know what is truth and what is not in the man thoughts of their religion.
This is a very important point.  Now, one can really improve their mind.
I better state here that the word spiritually is used to mean non man thoughts in this application. So, one should not confuse this meaning.

I think there is enough here to digest until the next one, which will bring god into the picture, and show how he relates to this.

No, I better do it now. :O)

It's my belief that god is the same for all religions, even though each religion doesn't think so. The reason, they don't think so, is they can't get past the man terms and move to the spiritually thinking level so they can understand, and sort the real truth of their religion. They profess to do so, but the fact that they do not understand shows they do not. I sure wish they did. :O)

Note a very important point here.
The spiritual god is the same as the god, thought of in man terms, only set free.

Another important point.
One does not have to go through the religion thing, the religions would have one to believe.
One can believe in the spiritual god, which is much easier to take, which is actually the same god.  So, what's the beef here?
The religions clam one can not do this.
Since I believe all the religions have the same god, learning one or the others religious preaching's is not needed. it may be desired by some and that's ok too. But what one needs, another may not. At this point in my life, I don't need the religious stuff to drag me down.  I also understand that it may drag others up. That's ok.

This all started when I said I was likely agnostic, which means, one can not know if there is or is not a god, because one can not find the truth.
This also allows one to lean one way or the other, at different times to try to find the truth which is also very helpful.

But to tell the truth, in my quest to try to make all this understandable, I have a better understanding of it all.
Now I lean toward believing in god, spiritually.
We will see where this all leads down the path of life.

This is the third and final peace.
If I had to call it something, I'd call it, The Understanding.
Note, what I put in the subject, philosophy, 0 to infinity.

That's for those that try to put a religion or philosophy on what I'm saying here.
It's all in my mind and is none of these. It's my "mind philosophy" if you need something.

Part two was developed in my mind after my note, of the existence of the understanding levels, just after I reached the age of 35. I'd say this formed during the period of 35 to 40. It's been here, but I never had to put it in thoughts one can understand.
And it's not something I need to talk about much. I'm mostly writing this for a friend, the person this discussion was intended for, to give him some more understanding. This has also been very beneficial to my understanding.

Part two was written in the simplest form so anyone can understand it.
Or at least that was my aim.  If one reads in more than is there, one will have a harder time of getting the true meaning. I used simple little words as much as I could and that is exactly what was really needed.

It has been suggested that I use rational thinking in place of man term thoughts.
It would work, but not as well, and would add more confusion when people try to figure out what I meant by rational thinking. I would rather, not complicate things, any more then they already are. That's why I'm using man terms.  I'm writing this for even those that do not know what rational thinking is. And those that do, will try to make it something it is not. Yes, I'm tying to hit at the lowest levels, and the levels one's are stuck in, I’m trying to make this the most understandable thing I've ever done. :O) If I'd like to be known for anything, it is that I've imparted this information, in a way that most are capable of understanding. :O)


Part three is called, my third peace, for a reason. It's an accumulation of years of thinking and understanding. It's really the part of my thinking that was triggered by trying to put the first two parts into man terms, or words in an understandable form.
I figure it must be my reward for pursuing this. :O)

It will also be the most difficult part to write in man terms.
I've been able to put each thought into man terms, in my mind, but the difficulty, will be in putting it all together to obtain an elegant ending for you.

So, let's get started with a class I had to take when I was about twenty-four in junior college. I was required to take a humanities class. I was already put off by the religions I had come in contact with, so I looked for the easiest one in the list, that I didn't know anything about.  The class was about the Tao, pronounced Dow.  The first day of class, the teacher told us we would study the Tao by using a poem in a little book we had to buy.
Buy it and read the poem for the next class was his assignment.
So, I bought the book. I read through the poem and had no understanding of what it was trying to convey to me. I wasn't any good at poems, at this time, so I thought that was the reason for my lack of understanding.  Anyway, the next class, guess who the teacher called on?  You guessed it.  He said, what do you understand about the poem?
I said, I didn't understand it.  He blew up. :O) He said, you didn't read it.
I said nothing.
We had classes for about two weeks, and talked in circles and didn't learn a thing about the Tao.

However, the class was right after lunch and he came in late and drunk, one day, and very talkative. He informed us a Taoist is one with the universe and just is. They do not need, to try, to be. They just are, as they go about their business in life. He said the main thing about a Taoist, is if you are one, you cannot preach it, period, or you aren't really one.

Now, I saw why we weren't learning much in this class. He thought of himself as a Taoist. Which meant, he didn't think he could tell as anything and still be a Taoist, and he was right on that, but I didn't realize why at the time. The rest of the classes went without much input from him. I got a c. That's mainly all I knew about the Tao, even to this day. Which is likely good, because it helped me see something about the Tao a couple days ago.

The next significant class on this, I had, was a philosophy 101 class in college, at about the age of twenty-seven. A very lovely smiling, older lady, taught me that, God is all knowing, all forgiving and all powerful.

That sure puts God above man and conflicted with all I had learned of religions up to this time. With logic, she showed us there is really no way of knowing, for sure, if there is a god, or there is not a God. In my mind, that also meant, that there was no way man could ever be a God.

A fresh look so to speak. She taught me the word agnostic. And I thought to myself, that's likely what I am. That was it for philosophy, except my 55 years of life's experiences.

So, now we can move forward to now. In an effort to convey where I am coming from, on this subject, to the person I've been having a discussion with, I asked him to check out the Tao on the internet and see if it would help him. He wrote back saying something of it, philosophy wise, very in the negative. So I wrote back and asked him to find the poem I had studied. Maybe he could understand it better than I.
He sent me a poem. I read the first few lines and thought to myself,....... this just isn't what the Tao is. Maybe it's not the right poem.  I found out later, it didn't really matter, this was good enough.

He also sent a few web pages about the Tao.
Everytime I stated to read one, I thought, this isn't the Tao.

All of a sudden, my new understanding kicked in. :O) :O)

The Tao teacher was wrong. He didn't understand and neither do all the people that wrote the Tao web pages. The poem was a spoof, that's why it didn't matter if he sent me the right poem or not.

My teacher had missed the whole point, but he was only about thirty five at the time. However, he had already put a limit on himself, by trying to practice, the so called religion of the Tao. One does not try to practice the Tao. One can only live it.

Let's see if I can explain this one.
And it doesn't really matter if I explain this to your agreement or not, as it is in my mind. And you also may need to move up levels of understanding to get the full gist of what this means.

From past things I've learned in life, I know that to be a true Taoist, one is,...... one with the universe. He does not and will not preach his religion, or even admit that it exits. Why is that?

That's what I finally understood. A true Taoist cannot write about his religion, because, they have reached many levels of understanding and do not think about their religion in man terms.  There are no words for their religion.

Well, there is one, that would describe them. It's just plain,...... the Tao.
Do not put religion with this word. If you do, it will be all bull.

Therefore, all that is written about the Tao religion is bull.
The poem was bull, likely written when a true Taoist was pressed to define his religion, which he could, in no way do, so he just wrote a poem of riddles to get the man term thinkers off his back, so he could go about his business of being one with the universe.  Don't miss-interpret, this one with the universe thing.
It really has a very simple meaning, so don't try to put more into it, than you should.  I will tell you that thing at the end of this. :O)

Of course, one understanding leads to some more understanding.
 
This shows what can happen to a religion, once man starts writing about it.
As soon as that first pen hits the paper, every religion is distorted with man thoughts of man terms. The longer that religion exits in time, the more likely it will get distorted.

This is not to say, that one should never write about religions, otherwise, how would anyone else know about it? And besides, whose going to stop people from doing it?  So, it really is very important for one to obtain high enough levels of understanding to sort though all the writings and get to the truth, so one may advance to higher levels. Getting to higher levels, should not necessarily negate ones religion, but should instead help one to understand it better.

Wow, I have the feeling this is winding up. :O)

The Tao can be thought of as, spiritual thinkers of God.
The same God every other religion thinks of,...... in man terms.

What this means is, one does not have to be a Taoist to think of god in the spiritual way. You can do this in any religion. One just has to get past the man stuff.

I feel a since of relief in getting this far. It's like a big load off my shoulders. :O)

This also shows me, why I generally do not talk of this kind of stuff.
It's really easier, not to put it in man terms. And when I do, I can not be totally accurate and truthful.

I did promise you, I would tell you what I found of God, in the spiritual thinking of him. This can also be thought of, as, one with the universe, in the Taoist way.

It is really very, very simple. Almost too simple. And since I have to put it in man terms, it is not totally accurate either, but, it's the best I can do at this time of my level of understanding.
The feeling I get from God is this.          Be yourself,........... no plastic.

That's it. It's all he wants and needs.  He has everything else. :O)
When people think of god in man term thoughts, they tend to overthink everything and complicate everything. When one gets to the truth, it is very simple, indeed.
I hate it when I have to speak for God. I can't really do it, I shouldn't really try.

I should point out, someone else's spiritual thinkings of God, may not and, it is not important, to come to the same conclusion. That's what happens when one tries to put God thoughts into man terms.

One should also note here that there are other ways of getting to this point.
This is only my way.


Now that I've said all this, I'm leaving it and going back to the spiritual way. :O)
It's such a happy place to be. :O)
Do what you want with this. It could also be considered bull.

However, if you are on a high enough level, you will understand just what it is I have put to paper here,....... for your understanding. :O)
I've just given you something worth an untold sum.
And I don't mean that to be a brag, but I'm on a high enough level of understanding to understand what it is, I have put forth in these three parts. 

Are you? :O)

Bob Noble
www.sonic.net/bnoble

More on how the word spiritual is used. 

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