THE
ARCANE
ARCHIVE

a cache of usenet and other text files pertaining
to occult, mystical, and spiritual subjects.


TOP | YRONWODE | ARCANE ARCHIVE.ORG | OCCULTISM | DIVINATION

Marseille Tarot Age, Key 11, Return

To: alt.magick.tyagi,alt.magick,alt.tarot,alt.divination,alt.religion.wicca
From: nagasiva 
Subject: Marseille Tarot Age, Key 11, Return 
Date: Thu, 16 Oct 2003 09:27:37 GMT

50031016 viii om

Sir Brax:
#> I stand on the "Traditional" side. When I Took the "Marseille Tarot" as
#> First, and only valuable references to talk about the "Book" who is 
#> behind the card, it is because our most Known and Old version of the 
#> Tarot IS the Marseille deck. It could be that the Marseille is The 
#> first "materialization" of the Tarot itself, since no one had ever 
#> found a more ancien Tarot that these one. But that is another story 
#> to be told, and to be found... In this deck, justice is the 8th 
#> Arcana, Strenght is the 11th...

Caliban :
# While neither I, nor anyone else, can produce an earlier Tarot, 

Visconti and Visconti-Sforza, Tarocchi of Mantegna, etc. 
precede Marseille I think (Kaplan calling the last an 18th
century Tarot deck). if you're just talking about (occult)
Tarot, then that's a topic I find immensely interesting
(because art historians I've talked with said that this
deck was fabricated for the purpose of playing games, 
so the issue immediately becomes when and how it 
should be included in (occult) Tarot tradition).

has it been integrated to described occult practices,
mapped to sefirotic trees or engaged in visualizations
or something, within ritual contexts? I wouldn't be very
surprised if so, but I've not heard of the orders doing 
this (French I'd guess, maybe Martinists).

# I believe there certainly was one, dating as far back 
# as Ancient Egypt.

LOL! Mamluk?

# It's only a theory, of course, but it feels right 
# to me. 

when I project backward I prefer to make it upon some
fantastic past, like the time of some Taoist magician:
Three Lost Keys of Fu Hsi (originally a 9 x 9 square). ;>
Fu was a naga (draconic entity) instructor of the Chinese,
and creator also of the Yijing, mapped to a 8 x 8 square.

my vision is that he has some cosmic device mapped to
magic squares of every planet with a divination game:

N    2       Mercury: YICHESS      (8x8 64 hexagrams)
I    1       Sun    : SHIVA        (6x6 36 dicethrows)
G    6       Jupiter: GEOMANTICA   (4x4 16 geomantic figures)
     M       Moon   : TAROT        (9x9 81 cards (78 + 3 Fu Xi Keys))
R    3       Venus  : ASHTA-KASHTE (7x7 49 sigils (Babalonian dowsing?))
I    5       Mars   : ALBEQUERQUE  (5x5 25 runes (Blumian Futhark))
S    7       Saturn : MERELS       (3x3  9 Lo Shu Tic Tac Toe squares)

# ...the turning of the Wheel, numbered 10, would 
# require a re-balancing which occurs with Justice 
# at 11. 

that depends on when the cycle terminates and starts.
granted a zodiacal and Babylonian slant, you'd have
11 as not-quite-completion to 12 and return to 1,
for example.

# This, to me, is a more natural order. 

11 as the beginning of another sequence as compared
with 8? that's quite convincing, yes. 9-terminus and
10 the new cycle is a competitor for 11, however.

# Additionally, Justice is frequently associated with
# Balance, particularly in Ancient Egypt where the 
# Lord of the Dead, Osiris, is nothing if not a 
# master of balance.

I favour L BALANCE LIBRA XI 22 as its composure for
similar reasons. the scales are a feature of Libran 
symbolism way back. I tend to think that anarchism 
is contrary to Justice, so I renamed the card. XI's 
relation to 22 Trumps generally is relevant here
(being the Balance of the Large). Plebeian Tarot 
features M PASSION LUNA 23 as said Trump of Return. 
              
nagasiva

     ===========================================================
     =====  (Planetary Order Talisman --- Skip-1 Formula!) =====
      ANCIENTS : M-2-3-1-5-6-7 (mean terracentric motion order)
       NIGRIS  : 2-1-6-M-3-5-7 (a mysterious, hidden sequence!)
      WEEKDAYS : 1-M-5-2-6-3-7 (weekdays in the solar calendar)
     ===========================================================
      PLAN-KEY : 1-2-3-M-5-6-7 (Sun-Merc-Ven-Moon-Mars-Jup-Sat)
     ========== (Rotating Wisdom From The Ancients!) ===========
     ===========================================================
-- 
yronwode.com@nagasiva; http://www.satanservice.org/
emailed replies may be posted; cc replies if response desired; 
HOODOO CATALOGUE! send street addy to: catalogue@luckymojo.com

The Arcane Archive is copyright by the authors cited.
Send comments to the Arcane Archivist: tyaginator@arcane-archive.org.

Did you like what you read here? Find it useful?
Then please click on the Paypal Secure Server logo and make a small
donation to the site maintainer for the creation and upkeep of this site.

The ARCANE ARCHIVE is a large domain,
organized into a number of sub-directories,
each dealing with a different branch of
religion, mysticism, occultism, or esoteric knowledge.
Here are the major ARCANE ARCHIVE directories you can visit:
interdisciplinary: geometry, natural proportion, ratio, archaeoastronomy
mysticism: enlightenment, self-realization, trance, meditation, consciousness
occultism: divination, hermeticism, amulets, sigils, magick, witchcraft, spells
religion: buddhism, christianity, hinduism, islam, judaism, taoism, wicca, voodoo
societies and fraternal orders: freemasonry, golden dawn, rosicrucians, etc.

SEARCH THE ARCANE ARCHIVE

There are thousands of web pages at the ARCANE ARCHIVE. You can use ATOMZ.COM
to search for a single word (like witchcraft, hoodoo, pagan, or magic) or an
exact phrase (like Kwan Yin, golden ratio, or book of shadows):

Search For:
Match:  Any word All words Exact phrase

OTHER ESOTERIC AND OCCULT SITES OF INTEREST

Southern Spirits: 19th and 20th century accounts of hoodoo, including slave narratives & interviews
Hoodoo in Theory and Practice by cat yronwode: an introduction to African-American rootwork
Lucky W Amulet Archive by cat yronwode: an online museum of worldwide talismans and charms
Sacred Sex: essays and articles on tantra yoga, neo-tantra, karezza, sex magic, and sex worship
Sacred Landscape: essays and articles on archaeoastronomy, sacred architecture, and sacred geometry
Lucky Mojo Forum: practitioners answer queries on conjure; sponsored by the Lucky Mojo Curio Co.
Herb Magic: illustrated descriptions of magic herbs with free spells, recipes, and an ordering option
Association of Independent Readers and Rootworkers: ethical diviners and hoodoo spell-casters
Freemasonry for Women by cat yronwode: a history of mixed-gender Freemasonic lodges
Missionary Independent Spiritual Church: spirit-led, inter-faith, the Smallest Church in the World
Satan Service Org: an archive presenting the theory, practice, and history of Satanism and Satanists
Gospel of Satan: the story of Jesus and the angels, from the perspective of the God of this World
Lucky Mojo Usenet FAQ Archive: FAQs and REFs for occult and magical usenet newsgroups
Candles and Curios: essays and articles on traditional African American conjure and folk magic
Aleister Crowley Text Archive: a multitude of texts by an early 20th century ceremonial occultist
Spiritual Spells: lessons in folk magic and spell casting from an eclectic Wiccan perspective
The Mystic Tea Room: divination by reading tea-leaves, with a museum of antique fortune telling cups
Yronwode Institution for the Preservation and Popularization of Indigenous Ethnomagicology
Yronwode Home: personal pages of catherine yronwode and nagasiva yronwode, magical archivists
Lucky Mojo Magic Spells Archives: love spells, money spells, luck spells, protection spells, etc.
      Free Love Spell Archive: love spells, attraction spells, sex magick, romance spells, and lust spells
      Free Money Spell Archive: money spells, prosperity spells, and wealth spells for job and business
      Free Protection Spell Archive: protection spells against witchcraft, jinxes, hexes, and the evil eye
      Free Gambling Luck Spell Archive: lucky gambling spells for the lottery, casinos, and races